Location: BC Canada Joined: 18 May 2007 Posts: 50 Born: 15 November 2008 Gender: Female
Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 6:41 pm Post subject: Juice fasting to detox, and then clean start with vl carb
Hi everyone!
I was gone for awhile, but I am back. Many, many personal things going on and then that horrible binge over the holidays...'nuff said.
I read the articles Dean posted on fasting and detox. This has lead me in search of more information.
I found tons of sites about water fasting, the master cleanse fasting and juice fasting.
Many juice fasting sites expect people to go straight into a raw vegan style WOE, but I would NOT be one of those people! Have they ever smelled the aroma of meat grilled over open flame? Which is why now is a good time to try a juice fast (too cold this week to be outside cooking meat, so no temptation from the neighbors).
Juice fasting appeals to me because I really don't like eating vegetables. I have tried over the years, but since reading many posts on this site from the pure carnivores, it was really easy to clear out that leafy green stuff and replace it with cheese and more eggs.
However, since Christmas I have eaten nothing but crap and have had a hard time even getting myself to eat meat- such is the pull of cheap chocolate and phyllo pastry appies.
I am going to try this for a couple of days (or longer if I can). And I would be lying if I said I was not interested in the rapid weight loss that accompanies a fast of this kind...apparently no saggy skin either. We will see...
Potassium broth: A couple of potatoes, some celery, carrots, onion and some herbs and hot pepper flakes. Drink this for breakfast and before bed.
* I have read that some people use a meat bouillon cube to torque up the flavor of this. I will mix it with some homemade beef broth, and see if everything works as planned.
Fresh veggie juice: whatever I can get organic. I have read lot's of recipes on the net, so I think I know which ones will mix for good flavor.
Fresh fruit juice: this is the fun part! apples and pineapple! grapes and bananas; melon juice.
Plus the requisite 2 litres of water daily (easy, peasy).
I will stick with my Slow Burn twice a week for exercise.
The point is to detox my system, clean out the colon of years of carbs and garbage food, and see if this helps my winter dry skin and year round allergies.
to break the fast I will add in whole fruits and veg, more meat broth, poached eggs, and then eventually REAL MEAT!! I want to go into a VLC way of eating, and maybe throw in some veggie juice once or twice a week, which should be enough. My kid is a total carb addict too, but I cannot put her on a fast (too young), so I am hoping the juice along with more portions of meat will help break her away from the carbs. It is hard to pack a good lunch for kids when there is no access for them to heat up meat dishes.
Ideally you should detox for at least 15 days to get any real benefit, and can safely fast for 40 days or more. I just want a clean slate to low carb onto. I also hope to do more fasting when the fresh veggies and fruits/berries come into season, but that would be a couple of days or a week at a time.
If anyone has any opinions or ideas for me, I would appreciate the input. This is an experiment. I may wimp out right in the beginning, however I did have that potassium broth mixed with beef broth last night and I am still not hungry, soooooo.....
Good luck with the dry skin, the only time mine feels good is when I'm eating over 300g of fat.
I pack my daughter chicken, tuna or ham salad, cut veggies, beef sticks, cheese sticks & nuts. She loves her lunches, because no one ever has what she has. And she says she's never starving hungry anymore when she gets home.
Good luck with the fast. _________________ Manaloa
Location: Flyover Zone Joined: 05 Jul 2006 Posts: 5143 Born: 3 January 2010 Gender: Male
Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 7:50 pm Post subject:
Hey, Mae,
Great to have ya back on the Bus!
If you are wanting to lose weight and detox, this might be a good way to do it. I think, in the long run, getting back to VLC is the right thing to do, as you are obviously wanting to do. It is sorta hard to lose while eating lots of animal fat. The way I see it, people get overweight by eating an unnatural diet, so losing that weight eating an unnatural diet may be the quickest way. Who knows. But, for weight maintenance, as many have already proved, a VLC diet seems to be the ticket, and it should come as no surprise, since that is our natural diet.
Good luck with the fast, and please keep us informed on how it goes for ya.
_________________ When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace. - Jimi Hendrix Every day you'll see the dust
Never get off the Bus!
Location: BC Canada Joined: 18 May 2007 Posts: 50 Born: 15 November 2008 Gender: Female
Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 8:57 pm Post subject: I really hope I am not being a bad infuence..
I don't want anyone to fall off the low carb wagon by reading these posts. I am posting just to give information to others about what I am doing.
Anyway, I seem to be down about 5 pounds (depends on what time of day I weigh myself). I have not hit that point where hunger stops, but I am getting used to the routine. You really have to keep on top of things. I am juicing for the next day because I have a couple of shifts at work that start at 5:30 am, and no way will I get up earlier to run the juice machine!
I am still drinking beef broth (homemade, no veggies), and it is so good and nourishing, but I hope I am not defeating myself. I drink it for breakfast and it gets me through about 2 hours.
You have to drink some form of juice about every 2 hours and drink water in between. I am drinking herbal tea as well.
I gotta tell you, so far the vegetable juice is just rude and gross. I made some with organic spring mixed greens, cucumber, celery, carrot, and a sweet potato; also an apple and half a lemon. Now that is a lot of veggies for one day! But that juice is gross. To be fair, I did read that you should not have more that 1/4 of your juice from green leafy stuff for just that reason (I think the quote was to have a barf bucket handy!), but I am trying to use it up before it goes bad. My mistake- which I will pay for all day today. :p
I am gonna try tomato, carrot and celery and then add to that whatever I can get that appeals to me , but I do not hold much hope that I will like veggie juice. It is so not V-8.
Fruit juice on the other hand is wonderful. We all know why too.
On another note: You are right Manaloa. I have just been caving to my daughters high carb cravings. Poor thing was eating so much junk over the holidays that she is very addicted now too. Today I gave her ham, cheese, some crackers (not too many) and some applesauce, and a bottle of water. I know it is my job to break her away from the high carb crap, and I thank you for reminding me that there are ways to incorporate low carb into a child's lunch. _________________ http://www.biblelife.org/plateau.htm this site has the best information all wrapped together.
Location: Flyover Zone Joined: 05 Jul 2006 Posts: 5143 Born: 3 January 2010 Gender: Male
Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:49 pm Post subject: Re: I really hope I am not being a bad infuence..
mae_west wrote:
I don't want anyone to fall off the low carb wagon by reading these posts.
Mae, I assure you, that won't be a problem for me. I hope you don't take offense to this, but, if anything, after reading your post, I'm very glad February is finally here! _________________ When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace. - Jimi Hendrix Every day you'll see the dust
Never get off the Bus!
Believe me I feel for you, it's been a real process weaning my daughter off high carb stuff too. And because I don't want to give her a complex about food, I tell her she brings her lunches at least 3 of 5 days and she gets to pick which days. Some weeks she brings her lunch everyday because she enjoys it so much now. Especially since I give her a bunch of options and she gets to pick. There are days she'll pack meat and cheese and almonds for lunch and that's it. But, boy, she sure didn't get there overnight. I figure she can't do too much damage with 2 meals a week.
I'm glad the juicing is working out for you. I don't think I could do it, I've never liked V-8 or even most fruit juices. _________________ Manaloa
If you are wanting to lose weight and detox, this might be a good way to do it. I think, in the long run, getting back to VLC is the right thing to do, as you are obviously wanting to do. It is sorta hard to lose while eating lots of animal fat. The way I see it, people get overweight by eating an unnatural diet, so losing that weight eating an unnatural diet may be the quickest way. Who knows. But, for weight maintenance, as many have already proved, a VLC diet seems to be the ticket, and it should come as no surprise, since that is our natural diet.
So Dean, are you saying that if someone has a lot of weight to lose, and still wants to eat VLC, they should try to limit animal fat, butter, etc. and just eat lean meats?
Location: Milton, Wisconsin, USA Joined: 06 Aug 2006 Posts: 6030 Born: 10 March 1960 Gender: Male
Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 6:09 pm Post subject:
I won't speak for Dean, but I think a high percnetage of fat is good, but I also think keeping calories in check will help. _________________ Eat, Drink and Be Merry, For Tomorrow We'll Die
Location: Canada Joined: 26 Feb 2007 Posts: 413 Gender: Female
Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 6:14 pm Post subject:
I'm not sure if that's what Dean is saying, but personally, I would highly recommend that you not do that! Firstly, fat is essential for life. Secondly and less importantly (but more apropot to weight loss), a high-protein, low-fat diet is ultimately a high-carb diet (due to protein being converted to fat), just like a high-carb, low-fat diet is ultimately a high saturated fat diet (through conversion of glucose into fat). Eating insufficient fat and lots of protein knocks you out of fat-burning mode and into glucose-burning mode. The excess protein you're eating will convert to glucose (at a rate of 58 - 70%, depending on the source you read) and you'll lose the benefit of being on a LC diet entirely, plus put a tremendous strain on the body.
In order to stay in fat-burning mode, it's generally accepted that one should consume at least 1 gram of fat for every gram of protein and carb, added together. Meaning there should be 1 gram of fat for every gram of non-fat. _________________ Red
Location: Flyover Zone Joined: 05 Jul 2006 Posts: 5143 Born: 3 January 2010 Gender: Male
Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 7:24 pm Post subject:
Yes, Kim... you definitely should keep eating your fatty meat!
What jeff and Red are saying is what I believe as well. You should keep your fat percentage high. The 80/20 rule is probably a very good one for a life long WOE, IMO.
IMO, eating as carnivorously as possible, keeping carbs as close to zero as possible, keeping your diet as clean as you can mentally stand, keeping your (animal) fat ratio as high as possible, while still getting adequate protein (and not much more), keeping your calories in check, plus doing a bit of IFing, is going to be the healthiest way to go.
If you are trying to lose weight, it is probably gonna be necessary to create a caloric deficit through keeping calories in check and exercising, but even if you are at a desired weight and body composition, eating a lot of calories (which you will find you will have to force yourself to do... just ask jeff) is really taxing on the body (just ask jeff about that too... I think he said he had one of the worst colds in his life while stuffing himself with food, which puts an unnecessary strain on the body).
If you eat natural animal foods, stay clear of any chemical additives that may give you problems, cut out the carbs, get adequate protein, and keep your fat ratio high, everything else seems to take care of itself, no matter what weight you are at. The more you weigh, the greater the calorie needs you have, so it's easy to stay under that naturally, especially with the appetite suppression you will get on this WOE. BTW, losing weight at a steady rate, and not too quickly, is healthier. You will be healthier along the way, the more you eat like this.
From what I keep seeing, it's when we stray from our natural diet that we get in trouble, and the SAD WOE is about as strayed as you can get! It's so fricken addicting and is used by people for emotional reasons. This ZCarnivore WOE is gonna help you get away from that type of behavior, though, with some determination. Just keep gettin' back on the Bus, no matter how many times you fall off. Everything will work out just fine.
_________________ When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace. - Jimi Hendrix Every day you'll see the dust
Never get off the Bus!
Location: Milton, Wisconsin, USA Joined: 06 Aug 2006 Posts: 6030 Born: 10 March 1960 Gender: Male
Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 8:56 pm Post subject:
Dean wrote:
If you are trying to lose weight, it is probably gonna be necessary to create a caloric deficit through keeping calories in check and exercising, but even if you are at a desired weight and body composition, eating a lot of calories (which you will find you will have to force yourself to do... just ask jeff) is really taxing on the body (just ask jeff about that too... I think he said he had one of the worst colds in his life while stuffing himself with food, which puts an unnecessary strain on the body).
All true. _________________ Eat, Drink and Be Merry, For Tomorrow We'll Die
Location: BC Canada Joined: 18 May 2007 Posts: 50 Born: 15 November 2008 Gender: Female
Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 4:58 am Post subject:
I love you guys! I learn so much just coming here and reading the posts...I know it will be great to be back on LC. I think that when I get off this fast, I can eat like I am supposed to eat.
I am finally free of the tummy growlies... a sign that I am going into detox mode. I guess when I stop thinking about chocolate is when I am at the deepest part of the detox (can't wait). I feel really great, but still think about eating junk (not cravings so much, but just thinking about it- probably because I am around food all day. I have not cheated tho). My mind seems to be clearing, and I have had the best sleeps this past week- really, really restful sleep. Can't remember how long it has been since that happened.
I was following Protein Power, mostly because I could eat fruit (which I was hoping to replace vegetables with) but clearly I was not ready for the carb impact. And not enough fat either, from the above posts. It pays to stick out the VLC for as long as possible before adding in other types of foods. Too easy to stray off the path.
I won't post my weigh loss until the end. I fear people will freak out. I will say that I am losing and I feel great. That should be enough (?)
IMO, eating as carnivorously as possible, keeping carbs as close to zero as possible, keeping your diet as clean as you can mentally stand, keeping your (animal) fat ratio as high as possible, while still getting adequate protein (and not much more), keeping your calories in check, plus doing a bit of IFing, is going to be the healthiest way to go.
So what is adequate protein and not much more? There are different opinions out there on the amount a person should eat.
Location: Flyover Zone Joined: 05 Jul 2006 Posts: 5143 Born: 3 January 2010 Gender: Male
Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 7:29 pm Post subject:
Kim wrote:
Dean wrote:
IMO, eating as carnivorously as possible, keeping carbs as close to zero as possible, keeping your diet as clean as you can mentally stand, keeping your (animal) fat ratio as high as possible, while still getting adequate protein (and not much more), keeping your calories in check, plus doing a bit of IFing, is going to be the healthiest way to go.
So what is adequate protein and not much more? There are different opinions out there on the amount a person should eat.
Kim
Kim,
Red or Dan would be good members to answer that question. I don't worry too much about such things. I just try to eat like once a day, which is easy on this WOE, and make sure to eat lots of animal fat, and I think it all works out, but if you wanna do closer tracking, I think Red can give you a lot of good info on that.
Good luck. I think you will get this thing figured out for yourself. Stay strong and give it a chance. You can always change what you're doing, but you should give things a chance to see the results you are looking for. I'm not saying that you are doing this, but lots of people only try VLC or any WOE for a short time, and then dismiss it as wrong for them. Transitions to new WOE are not always gonna feel good, but eventually, if they are correct for you, they will feel good. _________________ When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace. - Jimi Hendrix Every day you'll see the dust
Never get off the Bus!
Location: BC Canada Joined: 18 May 2007 Posts: 50 Born: 15 November 2008 Gender: Female
Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 10:53 pm Post subject:
Hi all!
I made a huge mistake following some goofball's recipe for the Master Cleanse. Too much cayenne and it was undrinkable. I thought MC would be a nice change from juicing on those busy days.
Master Cleanse is water, fresh lemon juice, maple syrup and cayenne. I am sure many people have heard of it as part of a diet, however it is supposed to be a cleanse, and a way to do what is closest to a water fast, but with some calories. If you follow the recipe and drink the correct amount, you should be drinking 1200 calories. There are many, many recipes on the net for this stuff. I was not prepared for how hot it would be or how repulsive it would taste. I ended up on an 8 hr. shift with nothing but water. I had to add some commercial juice (from where I work) because I could not stand that taste in my mouth.
When I got home, I had 2 HUGE mugs of beef broth and felt much better.
This morning I made a smoothie with strawberries and coconut milk- not sure if it was a good idea, but I did it anyway. This afternoon I made juice from carrots, apples , lemon and cucumber (all organic) and it is pretty good. I am almost finished drinking a liter of it.
Tonight is vegetable broth mixed with turkey stock. And the requisite 2 liters of water daily.
I have to guess my calorie totals because there is no nutritional info on cucumber juice. I am trying to keep track in fitday, but it is not easy. _________________ http://www.biblelife.org/plateau.htm this site has the best information all wrapped together.
Red or Dan would be good members to answer that question. I don't worry too much about such things. I just try to eat like once a day, which is easy on this WOE, and make sure to eat lots of animal fat, and I think it all works out, but if you wanna do closer tracking, I think Red can give you a lot of good info on that.
Good luck. I think you will get this thing figured out for yourself. Stay strong and give it a chance. You can always change what you're doing, but you should give things a chance to see the results you are looking for. I'm not saying that you are doing this, but lots of people only try VLC or any WOE for a short time, and then dismiss it as wrong for them. Transitions to new WOE are not always gonna feel good, but eventually, if they are correct for you, they will feel good.
I am getting results and actually feel pretty good the way I am eating. I guess I just like to be a perfectionist and make sure I am doing everything I can the right way. Before when I did lowcarb (less than 10 g) I lost 120 pds in 11 mo., no stalls, so I don't know why I am so worried about it now.
Location: Canada Joined: 26 Feb 2007 Posts: 413 Gender: Female
Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 11:46 pm Post subject:
Typically, the amount of protein that 'the experts' recommend is anywhere between 1 gram of protein per kilogram of your 'ideal' weight (that's what the Optimal Diet recommends), to 1 gram of protein per lb of lean body mass (your weight minus the fat, which can be determined with a bodyfat calculator/calipers). I try to aim for 60 - 70 and try not to eat more than 100 g on a regular basis. Every once in a while is no big deal. _________________ Red
Location: BC Canada Joined: 18 May 2007 Posts: 50 Born: 15 November 2008 Gender: Female
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 1:08 am Post subject:
UPDATE: Smoothie was a bad idea. too many berries or coconut milk? I don't know, but I gained weight. I am back on juice. _________________ http://www.biblelife.org/plateau.htm this site has the best information all wrapped together.
Location: BC Canada Joined: 18 May 2007 Posts: 50 Born: 15 November 2008 Gender: Female
Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 6:03 pm Post subject:
I was reading that I should look for fruits/veg that are beneficial to my blood type (A-), and juice them more due to them being more helpful with the detox. For my blood type...
apparently I should be a vegetarian!
NOT GOING TO HAPPEN! It is amazing to me that so many web sites that are dedicated to fasting all think you should go vegan after.
Update on the fast: took a couple of days to lose the weight I gained from the smoothie, but I am back to where I was before I drank it ( down 15 pounds total so far), but I have TOM, so we will see what next week brings. I am at day 9 of no cheat juice fasting. This is good, as it means I should be able to do the "meat and egg fast" (very low carb) for at least 9 day without cheating if I just keep the variety in there ( in the past I only got to day 6).
Had to do slow burn 3 x this past week because my exercise days got all screwed up. I was pretty weak by that 3rd time, tho, so I guess I need more rest between strength training days. Probably due to the juice fast- I have days of high energy and days of low energy and it is hard to time the strength days into that kind of random-ness. I do feel more motivated to do the strength training. I don't love it yet, but that takes time I guess. I do enjoy the benefits and I do have more muscle tone.
Location: Flyover Zone Joined: 05 Jul 2006 Posts: 5143 Born: 3 January 2010 Gender: Male
Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 7:26 pm Post subject:
Mae,
I'm a blood type A as well, and tried that diet for three whole months, just before goin' to Neanderthin, back in the Spring of '02. As soon as I ditched all that soy and started eating red meat, I felt like I had died and gone to heaven! The Blood Type Diet, IMO, is ludicrous!
Congrats on the weight loss, and to sticking to your fast! _________________ When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace. - Jimi Hendrix Every day you'll see the dust
Never get off the Bus!
Location: BC Canada Joined: 18 May 2007 Posts: 50 Born: 15 November 2008 Gender: Female
Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 10:00 pm Post subject:
I have read some pretty scary things about soy and I am not going there. I know from what I have eaten in the past that I need to stay away from carbs and packaged foods (most , if not all, contain soy products) and stick to natural foods.
I am still having cravings, but for the most part they are low carb and meat related. I think that is a good sign!
Location: Flyover Zone Joined: 05 Jul 2006 Posts: 5143 Born: 3 January 2010 Gender: Male
Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 10:02 pm Post subject:
Soy is extremely toxic! RUN from it! _________________ When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace. - Jimi Hendrix Every day you'll see the dust
Never get off the Bus!
Location: BC Canada Joined: 18 May 2007 Posts: 50 Born: 15 November 2008 Gender: Female
Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 4:31 pm Post subject:
I think going natural with food is the way to go. That being said, I cannot resist some un-natural foods (read that bacon).
Juice fasting is going well. I am losing weight at a steady pace. I have no hunger, but still a few cravings. My eyes seem to be getting better (all that beta carotene???). And the swelling (water retention) in my lower legs is gone. Used to be that when i took my socks off at the end of the day, I had visible dents in my ankles from where the socks were. That is gone. Must all that extra liquid in my system. This is a good sign too. I will be better able to judge what certain foods do to my body systems because most of the damage from eating junk foods will be wiped away. I can tell I am still detoxing as my tongue is coated (heavily) with this white pallor. When that clears, I can stop.
Location: Flyover Zone Joined: 05 Jul 2006 Posts: 5143 Born: 3 January 2010 Gender: Male
Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2008 8:26 pm Post subject:
Mae, sounds like you're doing great! Keep up the good work! _________________ When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace. - Jimi Hendrix Every day you'll see the dust
Never get off the Bus!
Location: BC Canada Joined: 18 May 2007 Posts: 50 Born: 15 November 2008 Gender: Female
Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2008 3:33 pm Post subject:
Well, my skin is not any softer, but I will keep up with the dry brushing. It could take up to 30 days to see any change, but that should speed up when I get back to eating meat and fat. For information on dry brushing:
http://www.naturalhealthtechnique...niques/Dry_Brushing_Technique.htm
I am looking forward to getting outside in the sunshine. I feel like too much of my life has been on hold because of my weight.
I had a specific goal weight in mind when I started this detox- based on what I had read are achievable results. Although I am close, I want to continue until I reach it. I know I will gain back some weight when I return to eating food, but it should come off again when I get my rhythm back from eating LC. I REALLY WANT TO BE AT MY GOAL WHEN I GO BACK TO LOW CARB. It is so close and I have not been this close since October 2004. My goal is achievable in the next 10 to 14 days.
I tried my fat jeans on (could not get them on after Christmas holiday food), and they are loose! No one has said anything to me at work about the loss of weight. They all think I am crazy, whether it is ultra low carb or this fast. But you can't argue with results.
...so I may be a bit late for the March challenge. I start my practicum for my new career right after Easter long weekend, and I want to look as good (weight wise) as I can. I am keeping up with my slow burn too, so as to be ready by summer for a new bathing suit!
I do look forward to some eggs fried in butter...and coffee with cream...mmmmmmmmm.. _________________ http://www.biblelife.org/plateau.htm this site has the best information all wrapped together.
Location: BC Canada Joined: 18 May 2007 Posts: 50 Born: 15 November 2008 Gender: Female
Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2008 5:14 pm Post subject:
Well, I have been adding in some whole foods. I started with cherries on Saturday (I had some in the freezer)
Sunday I had some more cherries, some frozen peaches and then I tried a couple of eggs poached (mmmmmmmmmmm). I am having a hard time not jumping the gun to start cooking meat products, but I have read that it can be nasty and painful to start eating heavier foods too quickly after a fast.
I can tell you that since I started adding in the food, my weight loss has stopped. I do want to say that I lost 25 pounds in about 22 days on the fast.
I expect to gain some weight (NOT TOO MUCH!!!) when I go back to eating, so this is my tester week for foods. I think dairy is partly responsible for my sinus congestion (wheat and garbage food being the other part)- I used to take something daily for the sneezing and runny nose stuff. I used a nasal spray (prescription) while on the fast, hoping it would help rid me of the dark circles under my eyes, and I am not sure what helped but I will be watching to see if or when the circles come back. It has been really nice to be able to breathe again. Note: I did not use the spray daily, only when I remembered to use it.
Looking forward to adding fat back in, because my skin did not get softer on the fast And did I tell you I stopped drinking coffee? I was on decaf due to my ulcer (no problems there during the fast), so many might thing it was no loss.
I would definitely recommend fasting for a few days a month for anyone who is looking to get rid of some unhealthy symptoms. It is much easier to find the culprit in your diet when most of your food is gone! But if you are having temptation problems or can't seem to break that bad eating habit, fasting is a real help. The daily detox symptoms are not that bad. _________________ http://www.biblelife.org/plateau.htm this site has the best information all wrapped together.
Location: Milton, Wisconsin, USA Joined: 06 Aug 2006 Posts: 6030 Born: 10 March 1960 Gender: Male
Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2008 5:19 pm Post subject:
25 pounds....amazing!!! Yet Vesna went 21 days of eatinig nothing and lost not a pound. Just goes to show that no two bodies are exactly alike. _________________ Eat, Drink and Be Merry, For Tomorrow We'll Die
Location: BC Canada Joined: 18 May 2007 Posts: 50 Born: 15 November 2008 Gender: Female
Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2008 6:13 pm Post subject:
It depends on how much you have to lose.
I read of a woman in her 40's who lost 12 pounds on a 40 day juice fast. That was all of her excess. You lose more on a fast based on how much extra you have to lose. More fat, more fat loss. Not to mention all the toxic crap in your bowels, excess fluids etc. etc. which really adds up.
Whereas I have much more to lose. I lost about 8 pounds in the first couple of days, and then around 1 pound a day after that. My weight loss stalled when I drank juice with too much pulp -which adds fiber, and your body thinks you are starting to feed it again and acts accordingly. You then go into starvation mode when you only feed yourself more pulpy juice. I had to water fast a couple of times to get back into weight loss mode and not feel hungry. I also felt better when I did those couple of water only days - more toxic cleansing I suppose. I did not get around to straining my juices, mostly as a time factor. I would juice at the last minute to maintain the freshness of my juice for work.
I could have lost another 5 to 8 pounds this week if I was not adding in food so I can be in the March challenge. I will assume that doing a meat and egg type woe will help me to lose what I gain back this week and more, and depending on the numbers I may have to stay on this challenge for awhile.
I am figuring out some of this stuff in hindsight. This has been a huge learning experience for me. A positive experience.
edit* i would be interested to know what Vesna did during those 21 days. I would like to compare notes. _________________ http://www.biblelife.org/plateau.htm this site has the best information all wrapped together.
Location: Flyover Zone Joined: 05 Jul 2006 Posts: 5143 Born: 3 January 2010 Gender: Male
Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2008 7:07 pm Post subject:
Mae,
As long as you avoid the Disallowed items, you can eat whatever your want on the Allowed item list, which would include just water fasting, or even juicing with VLC vegetation.
BTW, congrats on the loss!... and the cleanse!
And, thanks so much for sharing your story! This sounds wonderful. _________________ When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace. - Jimi Hendrix Every day you'll see the dust
Never get off the Bus!
Location: BC Canada Joined: 18 May 2007 Posts: 50 Born: 15 November 2008 Gender: Female
Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2008 9:18 pm Post subject:
I know I should be paying more attention to things...this is what happens when you try to read a book and watch tv at the same time.
yesterday I was watching discovery health.ca and Dr. Oz was on there with a show called "the truth about food" (ha!). They had several experiments going on throughout the show and came back to them off and on for the hour.
One was a group of vegetarians who decided to eat meat for 2 months to see if it would improve their strength doing martial arts- their hobby of choice... you should have seen them gagging! I think it was only 1 out of 6 that said yes; the others did not see an improvement. Not like there are a million variables out there for this experiment...they were probably still eating all the carby/full of additive type food they were eating before plus the 2 or 4 oz of meat daily.
Also one with fire fighters eating a large meal at lunch vs. small portions meted out every 90 minutes (that one won).
Now here is where my memory is fuzzy (oddly enough I am reading a book on the brain healing itself...) I think they had an experiment that had to do with visualizing eating carbs. It was stressed out taxi drivers in Britian, and the idea was that they should eat some carby food to give them strength in dealing with their day or their customers. However, they don't have time to eat, drive and converse so they had to imagine they were eating the carbs, which apparently had the same effect on their bodies as actually eating the carbs (probably one of those b vitamins in bread help relax you kind of things). I wished that I had watched the whole show from the start, but that thing with the vegetarians just seemed so stupid to me, I had to keep switching channels.
Anyway, the gist of it that the visualizations do just as much to your health (if you are visualizing carb foods) as eating the actual food. This does go hand in hand with the brain book I am reading. We can program our brain- to an extent- to help repair functions that have been lost. If we make ourselves more sluggish just by consistently thinking about bread or doughnuts (which is what would happen), imagine how long it will take us to get healthy! That just creeped me out! Imagine all the obese people out there dreaming of their cakes and cookies while on a low fat diet, and you can see how easy it would be to get defeated.
Long story short, instead of allowing the imagination to complete the thought of carby foods, it must be trained to think of meat! or eggs.
You know the above is kind of true. When I am being good eating my meat and eggs, sometimes I am really craving sweets, thinking about them all day and looking at recipes, I wonder if that is raising my insulin levels just thinking about it.
Location: Flyover Zone Joined: 05 Jul 2006 Posts: 5143 Born: 3 January 2010 Gender: Male
Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2008 9:30 pm Post subject:
Mae, you're not an idiot... you've just been away from food so long, you're starting to dream about eating again. _________________ When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace. - Jimi Hendrix Every day you'll see the dust
Never get off the Bus!
Location: Milton, Wisconsin, USA Joined: 06 Aug 2006 Posts: 6030 Born: 10 March 1960 Gender: Male
Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 1:13 am Post subject:
Kim wrote:
You know the above is kind of true. When I am being good eating my meat and eggs, sometimes I am really craving sweets, thinking about them all day and looking at recipes, I wonder if that is raising my insulin levels just thinking about it.
Kim
Yes, in GC,BC Taubes does say that just thinking about eating can provoke an insulin response. Just like Pavlov's dogs. It's a real, physical response to an anticipated event. _________________ Eat, Drink and Be Merry, For Tomorrow We'll Die
Location: Flyover Zone Joined: 05 Jul 2006 Posts: 5143 Born: 3 January 2010 Gender: Male
Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 1:15 am Post subject:
So, like I told Tracy... don't even think about it! _________________ When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace. - Jimi Hendrix Every day you'll see the dust
Never get off the Bus!
Location: BC Canada Joined: 18 May 2007 Posts: 50 Born: 15 November 2008 Gender: Female
Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 1:23 am Post subject:
Dean wrote:
Mae, you're not an idiot... you've just been away from food so long, you're starting to dream about eating again.
I never stopped dreaming of eating food...that was my problem! _________________ http://www.biblelife.org/plateau.htm this site has the best information all wrapped together.
Location: BC Canada Joined: 18 May 2007 Posts: 50 Born: 15 November 2008 Gender: Female
Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 7:15 pm Post subject:
I am going to enjoy some hot italien sausage, mushrooms and eggs before they become off limits.
and some chicken wings for supper (and lunch tomorrow). with salted butter- which I buy for my kid. unsalted would be lost in hot sauce!
I have gained back about 4.5 pounds, which should disappear by next week if this woe works. I am going to put my foods in fitday and tweak the fat. I remember having that problem on another forum- I just could not figure out how much fat to have or protein. (I think it was too much dairy).
I am sticking with goal weight in kgs = grams of protein and will then work on how much fat to eat daily. Looking forward to softer skin! _________________ http://www.biblelife.org/plateau.htm this site has the best information all wrapped together.
Location: BC Canada Joined: 18 May 2007 Posts: 50 Born: 15 November 2008 Gender: Female
Posted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 4:09 pm Post subject:
Just in case anyone wants to know, I did the juice fast with PMS and my symptoms were MINIMAL. I also did it through TOM, and the symptoms were MINIMAL.
Since returning to the land of eating solid food:
-my ankle pain has returned ( arthritis from a ligament injury)
-my sinuses seem to be dripping all the time
-it takes me forever to fall asleep - and I wake up several times during the night. On the fast I could sleep through 8 hours straight.
I will add more as I think of things. _________________ http://www.biblelife.org/plateau.htm this site has the best information all wrapped together.
Location: Canada Joined: 18 Jan 2008 Posts: 430 Born: 14 August 1976 Gender: Female
Posted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 4:43 pm Post subject:
Did you add one food at a time in order to have an idea of what foods potentially caused problems for you? Like one food every 3-4 days. _________________ "When you give up your dream, you die"
Location: Flyover Zone Joined: 05 Jul 2006 Posts: 5143 Born: 3 January 2010 Gender: Male
Posted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 9:10 pm Post subject:
Mae,
With the amount of IFing I do, and the benefits I see from it, what you describe doesn't surprise me. Are you doing any IFing, or are you eating frequently throughout the day? If you're eating more often, that could explain your symptoms, plus, of course, what you're eating. _________________ When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace. - Jimi Hendrix Every day you'll see the dust
Never get off the Bus!
Location: BC Canada Joined: 18 May 2007 Posts: 50 Born: 15 November 2008 Gender: Female
Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 2:00 am Post subject:
I started back eating raw fruit along with the juice. Next I added some poached eggs, and banana (2 days). I had chicken broth with some veg and meat for 2 days, then I started eating more meat gearing up for the challenge. It could be the processed meats, so I should be able to tell over this challenge. I just know I have some killer PMS happening! ahhhhhh! look out! she's gonna blow!!!!!
Could not do any other sort of allergy testing or I would not be able to take part in the March hardcore challenge. I want to try this after the challenge, because I was eating so much junk before I could not tell what was bothering me.
I just thought it was worthy to note. If my allergy symptoms leave again, and the cramps aren't too bad during this clean meat month, I will seriously have to reconsider how I want to proceed with eating. I think it may be a challenge in itself to eat clean carnivore all the time; I should know more by next week.
I gotta say I am fairly interested in that raw meat way of eating too. It just seems so "pure". _________________ http://www.biblelife.org/plateau.htm this site has the best information all wrapped together.
Location: Madison, WI Joined: 02 Jan 2008 Posts: 116 Gender: Female
Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 12:29 pm Post subject:
mae_west wrote:
I can tell you that since I started adding in the food, my weight loss has stopped. I do want to say that I lost 25 pounds in about 22 days on the fast.
mae_west wrote:
It depends on how much you have to lose.
jeff wrote:
25 pounds....amazing!!! Yet Vesna went 21 days of eatinig nothing and lost not a pound. Just goes to show that no two bodies are exactly alike.
Sorry I'm coming in late, I just saw these posts.
I weighed in the mid-160s at that time, or around 40 pounds overweight.
Jeff, we can't say anything quite as specific as "lost not a pound," because I didn't weigh right before and right after. But we can say that I felt the same, I looked the same, my clothes felt the same, and not a soul commented that I looked like I'd lost any weight. In fact, my close friends politely and quietly commented on the opposite -- how surprising that I looked no different after taking in nothing but water for three weeks.
After the fast, I gained about twenty more pounds, perhaps more. The higher the scale got, the more afraid I was to get on it.
Now I know about the rebound post-starvation effect that Taubes writes about, where the body deprived of nutrition quickly gains back whatever was lost, plus extra fat.
On another point: it might be that drinking juice and drinking water are vastly different experiences for the body. In other words, it's not a given that mae_west would have lost more weight on a water fast than on a juice fast. In other words, the difference in our experiences might not be mainly because of differences between our bodies, but because a juice and a water fast are (perhaps) completely different.
Location: Milton, Wisconsin, USA Joined: 06 Aug 2006 Posts: 6030 Born: 10 March 1960 Gender: Male
Posted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 12:43 pm Post subject:
Quote:
On another point: it might be that drinking juice and drinking water are vastly different experiences for the body. In other words, it's not a given that mae_west would have lost more weight on a water fast than on a juice fast. In other words, the difference in our experiences might not be mainly because of differences between our bodies, but because a juice and a water fast are (perhaps) completely different.
That could very well be, Vesna. BTW, I'm glad to seem I'm not the only person up at 6:30 on a sunday morning.
_________________ Eat, Drink and Be Merry, For Tomorrow We'll Die
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And she says she's never starving hungry anymore when she gets home.
It's so fricken addicting and is used by people for emotional reasons. This ZCarnivore WOE is gonna help you get away from that type of behavior, though, with some determination. Just keep gettin' back on the Bus, no matter how many times you fall off. Everything will work out just fine. 
and started eating red meat, I felt like I had died and gone to heaven! The Blood Type Diet, IMO, is ludicrous!
And did I tell you I stopped drinking coffee? I was on decaf due to my ulcer (no problems there during the fast), so many might thing it was no loss. 
