BawdyWench: All the Bawdy Details!

BawdyWench · BawdyWench: All the Bawdy Details!

Here's the first post in my journal. I will ask people to NOT post until I get all my stats in. That way, I'll have a clear record of everything in one spot and can edit as things change. I'll let you know when you can join in -- assuming you WANT to join in!

LOL

BawdyWench

My Story: How I Came to Love the Low-Carb Lifestyle

So, how did I stumble onto this low-carb WOE? I'll try to make this brief.

I was going along, living life and steadily gaining a few more pounds each year. Never could I indulge in end-of-season sales because I never knew what size I would be next season when I could actually wear those clothes.

Nothing worked. I was doing the tried-and-true, everyone-believes-that-fat-makes-you-fat regimen, and still I gained. I wrote down every flipping fat gram I ate, kept it under 10 grams a day, and still I gained. I even added a strenuous 60-minute aerobic step routine 5 or 6 days a week. Still I gained.

How could I be gaining? I was under 1000 calories a day, virtually no fat, and exercising to beat the band. I was a devoted fan of Jean Brody and her "Living Life the High-Carbohydrate Way." Breakfast was two slices of dry whole-wheat toast. Lunch was a low-fat bagel with a half can of tuna with no-fat Miracle Whip and a half an apple. Dinner was a huge pile of pasta (hey, it's good for you, you know, and no fat!) with some steamed zucchini.

How could I be gaining? I went to the doctor, who sent me to a nutritionist who, by the way, looked like she had just come from the purging in the bathroom. She told me I had to eat the same thing every day. She and her husband always ate a balogna sandwich on white bread and an apple for lunch. Needless to say, she didn't give me anything to go on. I even showed her my food and exercise records. Not good enough, she said.

(I did say I was going to keep this short, right? Oh well.)

So, around this time I read a blurb in a women's magazine that said that despite what we've always heard, American women don't get enough protein in their diets.

Protein? What does that have to do wtih anything?

I was in a bookstore when I first laid eyes on "Protein Power" by the Drs. Eades. I bought it, took it home, and devoured it virtually in one sitting.

This makes sense! I've studied human paleontology and evolution since college (even took graduate courses for fun and aced every one, much to the chagrin of several of the "serious" grad students majoring in paleontology!).

Suddenly the light bulb went on. Wait a sec. We evolved eating meat with perhaps a few nuts, seeds, and berries thrown in when meat wasn't readily available. Human health went to hell in a handbasket when population growth exceeded the ability to live off hunting and people began to grow crops and get "civilized."

Well, you didn't have to hit me over the head too many times for the Eureka! moment to set in.

I was in love. First Protein Power, and then Atkins. I lost 30 pounds almost effortlessly. I was in heaven.

Then I felt I needed to work out more so as to tone my body. I started Body for Life. LOVED IT! Man, the feel of muscles I never knew I had. Amazing!

But then my workouts started to suffer (this is at least a year into it). In hindsight, I probably wasn't eating enough. Sure my ratios were about 70% fat, 20% protein, and 10% carbs, but I was eating only around 1200 calories a day, trying to do strenuous workouts.

So, I consulted the BFLers on "The Dark Side" and another board, "The Darker Side." Every one of them told me I had to eat more. But here's the kicker. I had to eat more sweet potatoes, regular potatoes, brown rice, whole grains, oatmeal, etc. That so went against my beliefs and training. How could these things be good for you? They even insisted I needed a free day to stuff my face with waffles, ice cream, cookies, and donuts so as to "re-feed" my body and let the reins out a little.

Well, letting the reins out a little turned into letting my pants out a little. I started gaining again.

It took a while, and a lot of soul searching, but I went back to the LC life I knew was right and got back down to 151, my lowest adult weight (other than when I was just married, when I was at 145).

This was just in time for my 50th birthday! Woo-hoo!!!!! My goal was to reach 150 by 50. I came within 1 pound, so I celebrated reaching goal.

Then life smacked me right between the eyes. Menopause. No major symptoms like hot flashes or night sweats at first. My only indication was that I gained 25 pounds in about 4 months! WITH NO CHANGE IN EATING OR EXERCISE!!!! And now I'm about 35 pounds up. Geezum crow!

Well, it turns out my hormones are all messed up and my adrenals are shot. Details to follow.

So that's BawdyWench's story in a nutshell.

BawdyWench

My Supplements (as of 9/4/06)

Multigenics with Iron: Basic multi-vitamin. I was told to take 6 a day, 2 at breakfast, 2 at lunch, and 2 at dinner. Made by Metagenics.

EPA-DHA Extra Strength: Fish oil. Made by Metagenics. 2 three times a day (total of 1800 mg EPA, 1200 mg DHA).

Cal-Apatite Forte: Combination of calcium, Vitamin D, and phosphorus. 3 a day. Total 600 IU of Vitamin D, 684 mg calcium, and 357 mg phosphorus. Also made by Metagenics.

Adreset: 1 in the morning and 1 at night. Combination of Cordeceps Mycelium extract, ginseng root extract, and rhodiola root extract. Described as "adaptognes that support an appropriate and healthy response to stress by promoting balanced hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis function. Adreset is designed to enhance stamina and energy, providing exceptional support for those who are stressed andn tired."

Selenium: 200 mcg once a day. Supposed to help thyroid function. Will be dropping this when the bottle runs out.

Astragalus: 1 three times a day. Total of 1.41 grams of astragalus root. Supposed to have "a normalizing effect on body functions," according to the container.

Isocort: 2 pellets in the morning and at lunch. Each pellet has 5 mg freeze-dried adrenal cortex, echinacea extract, prunus spp, and lomatium dissectum root. (Yum?) My last adrenal stress index came back with depressed cortisol output for the first two test periods -- first thing in the morning and before lunch.

Licorice Root: 1/8 tsp in the morning and at lunch. For adrenal function. This stuff tastes like liquified shoe leather that has been rotting in a fetid bog for 200 years.

Seriphos: 2 to 4 capsules before bed. 2 capsules contain a total of 105 mg calcium, 105 mg magnesium, 355 mg phosphorus, and 105 mg L-serine.

Magnesium Oxide: 1000 mg at bedtime (will be switching to chelated magnesium malate as soon as I can lay my hands on some)

Borage Oil: 1 capsule morning and night. Each capsule has 15 IU of Vitamin E and 500 mg borage oil. Supposed to be the best source for Gamma-Linolenic Acid (GLA), which is supposed to be extremely good for you. I take this on my own; the NP did not prescribe this.

DHEA: From a compounding pharmacist. I take 5 drops morning and night. 1 drop is 1 mg DHEA.

Estrogen: From a compounding pharmacist. I do 2 drops on the wrist morning and night. Not sure on the dosage here. The bottle says "30 - .E2 oil .25/4GTT"

Progesterone: From a compounding pharmacist. 2 capsules at night on days 1-14 of the month, and none the rest of the month. The dose is 100 mg Progesterone T.R.

My Supplements (as of 9/20/06)

Well, after finding out my cortisol is through the roof because of all the stupid supplements, here's what I'm doing now:

Multigenics with Iron: Basic multi-vitamin. I was told to take 6 a day, 2 at breakfast, 2 at lunch, and 2 at dinner. Made by Metagenics.

EPA-DHA Extra Strength: Fish oil. Made by Metagenics. 2 three times a day (total of 1800 mg EPA, 1200 mg DHA).

Magnesium Malate: 425 mg at bedtime

Borage Oil: 1 capsule morning and night. Each capsule has 15 IU of Vitamin E and 500 mg borage oil. Supposed to be the best source for Gamma-Linolenic Acid (GLA), which is supposed to be extremely good for you.

Green Tea Extract: 630 mg morning and night

Coffeeberry: 400 mg morning and night

BawdyWench

My Stats and Test Results

Thyroid ("normal" range in parens)
ccccc TSH: 3.84 (0.3 - 5.0)
ccccc Free T3: 2.4 (2.0 to 3.5)
ccccc Free T4: 1.1 (0.6 - 1.2)

cccccMy primary care physician won't treat me for hypoT. My NP doesn't want to treat me for it either.

Lipid Panel (ideal range in parens):
ccccc Total cholesterol: 206 (below 200)
ccccc LDL: 121 (below 130)
ccccc HDL: 73 (above 45)
ccccc Triglycerides: 62 (below 200)
ccccc Total divided by HDL: 2.82 (below 4.5)
ccccc LDL divided by HDL: 1.66 (below 3)
ccccc Triglycerides divided by HDL: .85 (below 2)

BawdyWench · My Body Log (Searching for that Bawdy Body)

Stay tuned ...

BawdyWench · Miscellaneous

Adrenal Stress Index (2/21/06)

Free Cortisol Rhythm: Depressed upon arising (12, scale of 13 - 24) and mid-morning (3, range of 5 - 10).

DHEA: Depressed (2, range of 3 - 10)

Insulin: Fasting was normal (<3, range of 3 - 12); post-prandial was depressed (3, range of 5 - 20)

Progesterone: Normal (36, optimal range of 22 - 100)

Total Salivary SigA: Depressed (<5, mormal 25 - 60)

Adrenal Stress Index (9/7/06)

Free Cortisol Rhythm: Off the charts. #1 was 120 (13-24), #2 was 17 (5-10), #3 was 15 (3-8), and #4 was 5 (1-4)

DHEA: Normal (7, range of 3 - 10); however, lab said the lack of DHEA elevation (coupled with the elevated cortisol levels) is bad and will likely turn into an overt DHEA deficiency.

Insulin: Fasting was normal (<3, range of 3 - 12); post-prandial was depressed (3, range of 5 - 20); I still think this is normal for a LC person

Progesterone: Normal (60, optimal range of 22 - 100)

Total Salivary SigA: Depressed (<5, mormal 25 - 60)

BawdyWench

I just wanted to thank Steve in public for all the help he's given me in PMs regarding supplements. It's such a confusing topic, and it's good to find someone who knows what he's talking about.

And a public thanks to everyone else who has welcomed me on the bus after an unfortunate misunderstanding. Enough said. You guys are great!

Steve

My pleasure Miss Bawdy..

Did you recieve my link for Lindberg Nutrtition and the Guggulbloic? Man that stuff has come down in price alot,,

BawdyWench

Just now. OK if I post the back-and-forth messages here so that I'll have them "forever" and other people can learn from them, too?

Alisa

BawdyWench

Just waiting for the go-ahead from Steve!

Steve

It's ok..I think I may have mentioned some of these compounds before..

Post away..

BawdyWench

Thanks, Steve!!!

I've been pestering Steve most of the day with questions and more questions regarding supplements. He's been a doll (that's not very manly, how about "a hunk"?) explaining it all to me. So that I don't lose track of everything he has told me, and so that others can also learn from his messages, I'm copying the entire exchange here.

BW: Hope you don't mind the PM. I was curious about a couple things you posted.

First, you said you wouldn't take calcium and magnesium together. Why? I thought they worked together.

Second, I was able to get some magnesium malate. I don't think it's chelated, though. I was lucky to find this. I read that I should take from 400 to 600 mg daily. The label says 3 tablets = 425 mg of magensium. I was thinking of taking 4 tablets daily, at least for a while. Should I take them all at once, or divided throughout the day?

Third, you mentioned guggalipids. The store was out of them, but will be restocking. What exactly will this do for me? My lipid panel is already very good.

Fourth, you said there are better things for thyroid than selenium. Can you give me some examples?

Fifth, I read just this morning that it's good to take supplements that will enhance insulin sensitivity. Any ideas?

Phew. I think that's it. There's just so much to know. That's why these forums are so useful.

THANKS!!!

Steve: Bawdy,you can write me anytimne!!
Guggulipids are the choice for thyroid..they acutally increase thyroid ouptut.

Your blood looks good for thyroid,but your TSH looks a little borderline high..and again,body temp is the best way to gauge your thyroid.

Vic Conte(Balco Labs and the Barry Bonds scandal) is the preeminent mineral specialist in the world..period... though he is morally corrupt.

He shows through blood work that when calcium and mag are consumed,they will compete at receptor sites and calcium will negate mag.

he thinks we take in way too much calcium.
(by the way,the Cal Appetite is the best calcium to use,it is basically the same component of bone..)

Now the question is why doesn't this happen through the food we eat or does it??

To be on the safe side,take the mag by itself. You should always take some of your dose right before bed..

Try down the road to get asporatate..this form seems to help cardio function more than other varieties..

Increasing insulin sensitivity is paramount for all of us. Due to our past high carb diets are receptors have been bombarded with insulin and have become desenistized as you know.

Thing you can do..use Cinammon liberally. They now have Cinammnon supplements as well.
Gymnema Sylvestre is als excellent but my favorite is Alpha Lipoic Acid. It works alot like Glucophage and I have seen type-2 diabetics get off their meds while taking Alpha Lipoic Acid.

It is also a potent antioxidant. It is about the only compound that works on the fat and water(soluble) parts of the cell..it is truly amazing.

But, since you are on a low carb diet,you probrably do not have much free glucose in your system, If you were to take it,start with about 50 mgs with a meal..then see if it lowers your blood sugar too much causing rebound hypoglycemia,it is rare but it does happen.

if your health food store has it,get Solarays Glucoreg..it is the best..It has everything that will increae sensitivity and is an excelent glucose disoposal agent.

If you already know this,I apologize but in regards to minerals...
Minerals taken not bound to something are completely inert in the body.
You just can't take a pure magnesium. When they bind these to citrate, oxide and malate,they do this so the body recognizes these compounds so you will absorb these minerals.

When something is chleated to an amino acid,your body readily absorbs amino acids,so it "recognizes" these aminos and the minerals are absorbed a well.

Again,write anytime,if you are not clear on somethings lt me know. I have all this stuff in my puny brain,but at times I have a hard time putting it down in a cohesive fashion.

good luck,and i gotta tell you ,you seem to be the most proactive person I've seen in regards to ones health.

BW: That's a lot to mull over! THANKS!!!!! And thanks for the compliment about being proactive. I'm sure trying. It's hard, though, when my NP tells me to do things one way, and everything I read tells me something different.

For example, she says carbs are absolutely essential for health, and wants me to do 90 grams a day. NO WAY! The past two times I went, I didn't bring up diet and she didn't either.

I do take the Cal-Apatite Forte. I take 1 capsule morning and night. I'm supposed to take one at noon, too, but I usually miss that dosage of everything.

BTW, all my supplements are listed in my new journal on this site.

At night I'm supposed to take up to 4 capsules of Seriphos. I usually take 2. She says it will help me sleep. Two capsules provides 105 mg calcium, 105 mg magnesium (doesn't say what kind), 355 mg phosphorus, and 105 mg L-Serine. The manufacturer is T.E. Neesby.

So, if you say I shouldn't take calcium and magnesium together, I should skip the Seriphos and take only the chelated magnesium at night (more on this later)?

All in all (and including the 2 Seriphos at night), I typically get 811 grams of calcium per day (not counting what's in food). I have between 1/4 and 1/3 cup of heavy cream each day, and rarely some cheese (not often at all).

How does this sound?

I'm definitely going to look into the guggalipids. Can you recommend a good line?

I have a stash of alpha-lipoic acid, so I'll start taking that. You said 50 mg at each meal? Like 3 times a day? If I take this, do I take the Solarays Glocoreg also?

As I mentioned, the magnesium I just bought is the malate. I read it's good for chronic fatigue syndrome. The manufacturer is Source Naturals. Since it doesn't say "chelated" anywhere, does that mean it's not a good source?

One more question. What's a good online source for purchasing supps?

You're the best!

Steve: You are taking the malate for fatigue..I see...usually malate and malic acid are combined for fibromyalgia..keep taking that then and keep on with the Cal apetite..you should be ok..Malate is supposed to help with cell energy production if I remember correctly. Stay with the Seriphos(?) but just be sure if it is helping you at all. Looks like it has an equal ratio of cal/mag..
Chelated just means that it is bound to an amino acid..so yes your malate is very good..

I love Source Naturals,they are also Planetary formulas and make killer products..I have met their forumlator many times..I think the 60's were hard on him lol

I once read somewhere that if you were just to eat a small cube of cheese,you would have all the calcium you need..
If you take the Glucoreg,it contains Alpha Lipoic Acid..so take yours first then you can check into the Glucoreg..

Take your Alpha Lipoic with each meal..yes 3x's a day..It will also help with oxidative damage so it has a nice 1-2 punch..

Guuglulipids from Natures Herbs,Solaray and Enzymatic therapy are good,but the best is Guggulbolic from Syntrax..though it is a little pricey it is made from this brown resin that is supposed to be the most potent form of it.

I'm not sure where you can go online for a nice variety of products for good prices..let me check around and I'll get back to you.

I have so many friends in the industry,that I get some stuff free or at very good pricing..

here is Lindberg Nutrtitional. I used to receive their catalog at home. Here is a very good price on the Guggulbolic by Syntrax. They also have a private label(which I'm not to sure about) and some products from some of the best companies around..

Hope this helps..

http://www.nutritionexpress.com/herbs/guggulsterones/

BawdyWench

I'm doing a test starting today regarding cream. Every morning I have a nog (1/4 to 1/3 cup heavy cream, 4 egg yolks, Splenda, vanilla, nutmeg). Sometimes I'm a little queasy afterward, and wondering if it could be a lactose-intolerant thing (or yeast, or who knows what). I've never really had a problem before, but things change.

So, starting today I'm using coconut milk instead of cream. It's about 4 carbs for 1/4 cup, twice as much as in cream, but if it's virtually the only carbs I get, I can live with that.

We'll see how it goes. I'm also going to try using Fitday for a while again. I don't think I'm taking in enough nourishment.

BawdyWench

Steve, you there?

One more question on supps and I'll never ask you for another thing. (I know. That line never works on DH either!)

DH has psoriasis on the palms of his hands. Really horrendous. So bad that sometimes they will bleed if he touches something.

He's gone to the doctor and they gave him first Betamethasone Valerate cream (0.1%), and when that didn't work, they gave him Clobetasol Propionate ointment (0.05%). Doesn't really work either. The second one is an ointment, so it's really messy. We've gone so far as to have him slather it on his hands before going to bed and then wearing latex gloves. (Great for the love life, let me tell you! NOT!!!!)

I've also gotten him taking regular multi-vitamins (from Puritan's Pride -- and I bought a ton of it!), magnesium (just switched both of us over to the malate), and Borage oil (1000 mg). He takes these most mornings (nothing throughout the day or before bedtime, nor will he -- stubborn).

So, is there anything else you can think of to help him out? He's a trainer and so has to meet new people all the time and stand up in front of people and use his hands. It's very embarrassing, to say the least.

This runs in his family. His older sister, who had it as bad or worse, eventually got past it. She used something from a compounding pharmacist, but it was years ago so she doesn't remember what it was.

Thoughts?

Thanx

Steve

Is he taking a boatload of fish oils?? I would have him take upward of 10+ grams a day if not more unitl it clears up.

How much borage is he taking? I would do one with each meal..

also some sort of anit-inflammatory would help alot..things like Turmeric and Galangal are the best anti-inflamatories available.

though the fish oil and the borage have anti-inflammatory properties,these are a little more specific to those type of prostaglandins..

Is he taking in vegetable oils or things/foods high in Omega 6'? if so have him elimnate those completely..

As far as a topical,we used to use Capsacin creme..be careful though,it is the compound that gives cayenne it bite!! It takes a few weeks though..

BawdyWench

A boatload? Not likely! It's all I can do to get him to take what he's taking now. He has a very erratic schedule, so asking him to take supps at lunch and dinner isn't going to work either.

He takes 1000 mg of Borage oil in the morning.

We use butter and sometimes olive oil to saute with. We broil a lot. We've both given up veggies -- he was never much of a veggie lover anyway. He does still eat potatoes (redskin or sweet potatoes), as do I on occasion.

I know he could do a lot to be in better health, but I gotta work with what I have and what he'll put up with, ya know?

I'll look into the capsasin cream. It doesn't sting?

BawdyWench

Feeling very pissy today. Last week, and especially over the weekend, I was feeling a bit leaner. My clothes fit better, and I felt like I could stand tall, suck in the gut, and feel good. Today was the total opposite. Pants were tight. Bra was tight. Roll, roll, roll your boat. I felt puffy and bloated.

I'm so sick and tired of feeling this way. I'm watching what I'm eating, and I've started working out again regularly. It's just getting worse. Since I started seeing the NP at Women to Women last January, I've now gained at least 10 pounds more.

The results from my re-test of adrenal function should be back this week. I just feel like all these supps I'm on are really not helping me at all. Things are supposed to be getting better, not worse.

Sorry for being so whiney, but this stinks!!!

Steve

Hi Bawdy..has your NP done any kinodf food allergy testing at all? Blood testing..

If you are sensitive to any thing you are eating,it can cause a dramatic effect on the bod and the mind...

Sounds something like that to me.. But who the hell am I??

With a little more detective work,you will find out what is wrong..
hang in there.

BawdyWench

Thanks for the cyber hug, Steve. No, within 5 minutes of talking with her the first time she had already diagnosed me with adrenal burnout. The tests showed that my cortisol was low upon waking up and mid-morning. So she put me on a slew of supps, as you know. I just don't think they're doing anything for me.

Since posting earlier, I looked at the mail and found the statement from the lab. That means the results have been sent to my NP. So, I should get the results by mail any day now.

The NP wants me eventually to do a liver cleanse system (Isagenix), which costs an arm and a leg. You have to buy their shakes, supplements, and bars and do this for at least a week. Don't know if she would recommend the week program or the month program. I just don't think eating all that processed food is better for me than eating real food.

Well, I'll wait and see what the results are. I'll post what I find out.

Thanks again!

Steve

You can do your own liver cleanses..and for a lot cheaper too..
things with Milk thistle,uva ursi,dandelion combos are very effective for your liver..you can get these all in one prodct at a health food store.

Ask her about the food allergy test..I found out I was allergic to almonds and egg whites.

BawdyWench

Will do. I'll ask about food allergies.

I posted the results of my first Adrenal Stress Index above (one of the first posts in this thread). When I get the new results, I'll post them there for comparison.

I'm going to bed. I had 2 glasses of wine and a T-bone with lots of butter. Even that didn't cheer me up.

Maybe tomorrow will be better.

Dean

Hey, Bawdy!

Hope all of this gets sorted out.

Just wanted to say hang in there and let us know how this all goes. Smile

Tomorrow WILL be better! Sunny

BawdyWench

Dean! Good to see you. I was starting to think you were ignoring your old pal ... not that I'm OLD, mind you!

Yea, I'm beginning to sound like Scarlett O'Hara ... "Tomorrow IS another day!"

No test results in the mail today. Felt a little better today. I did figure out today what the bloating was probably all about yesterday. On Sunday I ate a lot of cheese. I rarely eat cheese, but on Sunday I did. A lot. No more cheese for me! (Remember the "soup nazi" on Seinfeld?)

Karen

hi wench..my you sure get around.. LOL

so how is the coconut milk in the coffee ..i gotta know..i quit dairy a couple weeks ago and have been using soymilk in my coffee. But now i am finding all kinds of bad stuff about soy..so i need yet another alternative..i have some coconut milk..so i was thinking of trying it tomorrow in my coffee Shock

ill let you know how it goes...

i have no commments on supps and adrenals ..

BawdyWench

Karen, I don't use coconut milk in my coffee. I used it only a couple times as a substitute for heavy cream in my morning nog, but gave it up after an unpleasant experience one day. I had the nog, and not 10 minutes later, my digestive tract starting doing loop-di-loops and I had .... ummmm ... explosive ... ummmm ... well, you know.

Wow

I threw the rest away. This NEVER happened with the cream, and it couldn't be the eggs because I had the eggs from the same carton both the day before and the day after will no ill results.

If you try the coconut milk in your coffee, be sure you have the thick stuff. My grocery store carries two brands, Thai Kitchen and something else (forgot). The Thai Kitchen is very thick -- you even have to dump the whole thing into another (larger) container because the bottom half is water and the top half was nearly solid. You'd think it would be the other way around, huh?

The other brand is watery thin with chunks of solids. Not appealing to see or drink.

Both brands had virtually the same number of carbs.

Today I started of with a power breakfast. Couple cups of black coffee, my nog (1/3 cup heavy cream, 4 egg yolks, vanilla, Splenda, nutmeg), and 4 thick slices of bacon. Yummy! Now THAT should hold me for a while!

Yup

Jessica

On the coconut milk front... I've used the Thai brand, but I always dumped the whole can in my blender and blend, then kept in the fridge in a container. I think it's food for a week or so. Also once it's in the fridge in a blended state, it is VERY thick.

I find I do have issues with coconut milk, though, too. I've noticed when I make my morning smoothies with some, it leaves me hungery very soon, while if I use almond butter instead as my fat, i'm satisfied for hours after drinking it. I guess maybe my ancestors didn't eat many coconuts, lol, maybe that is why it bothers me...

Jessica

Karen

i have the thai kitchen organic coconut milk. This morning so far i had 2 cups of coffee..the first one i had my coconut oil AND the coconut milk (i mixed it up very well first). My second cup i had the coconut milk only! The coconut milk is kinda oily even by itself..lol. But YES it is pretty thick and i actually like it! its doable as a milk substitute for my coffee !! YAY!

As far as the bodily functions from coconut..that is pretty common till your body adjusts to it..from what i read..coconut will clean your system out and detox it and that is a good thing!

i think i am gonna try making a coconut smoothie tomorrow with the coc milk, bananas and raw egg yolks! ill let you know what i think of it!

BawdyWench

Karen

bawdy..i didnt have time to try the coconut smoothie today..my cousin was here most of the day..but i will let you know if i like it.

Also...ummm..forgot the coconut milk in my coffee..2 days of that was enough..im going to trader joes to get the organic unhomongonized cream!! i even slipped some half n half in my decaf tonight..i need some other use for coconut milk!

Karen

oh my gosh bawdy..i almost forgot to tell you what i read in the nourishing traditions book!! Now mind you this book isnt about low carb..but about whole foods. BUT..there was a teeny few sentences in the book that mentions those with ADRENAL problems should not eat any carbs at all!!! So you are on the right track!! Happy

BawdyWench

DADBLASTIT!!!!!

My test results are in from the adrenal stress index. NO WONDER I'VE GAINED YET ANOTHER 10-15 POUNDS LATELY!!!!

BECUASE OF THE MEDICATION THE NP PUT ME ON, I'M PUMPING OUT CORTISOL TO BEAT THE BAND!!!!

I'm pumping out enough cortisol to fatten an army of anorexics!!!!!

Wherease in my first test, my reading was "depressed" for the morning and before-lunch test, and I climbed into the normal range for the afternoon and night test, THIS TIME I'm way out of range on the HIGH side!!!!

The first time I took the test, my first reading was 12 in a scale of 13 - 24. Wanna know what it is now?

120!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now guess who I'm going to call first thing tomorrow morning and get some answers. Yup. The NP.

Looks like I'll be dropping those supplements, huh?

Steve

Bawdy,
I can attest for some of the things you are going through!

Have you ever wondered why taking an anti-inflammatory can cause rebound inflammation,or taking an antidepressant causing suicidal tendencies?

a far as your adrenal,your NP may have to tinker with the dosage..just like thyroid meds.

BawdyWench

Too much to think about right now. I have to go out of town on a sort of family emergency tomorrow morning.

I'll have to think about it later. I won't have computer access until Sunday night at the latest, and you might not hear from me again until Monday or Tuesday.

For now, I'm dropping the supplements. Done deal.

Karen

WOW Bawdy..

doesnt sound good. i have no idea what cortisol is so i dont know what is happening to you or why! hmm

Well have a good trip..see ya next week!

Sunny

BawdyWench

Hey, Karen! Cortisol is a hormone that is released in response to stress. It's also the "fat" hormone. For reasons I can't explain, when stresses become overwhelming, the body pumps out more and more cortisol in response, which results in belly fat. I did some research over the weekend on it. Hence my probably 15-pound weight gain over the past 3 or 4 weeks.

On the other board you asked what I was on to cause this. If you look up to one of my first posts here in my journal, you'll see all the supplements I've been taking.

DH and I were talking last night about it. I guess on one hand it's a little reassuring to know that these herbs and such really can have an effect on the body -- I've always been of the school of thought that regards herbs and other "natural" remedies to be merely placebos if not downright hooey. Guess not.

Just my luck these "harmless" herbs worked on my body like nothing before!

I have to leave the house by 9:00 to get to the airport, but I'm calling my NP to see what she thinks. I think I definitely need to drop the supps, but there might be a reason to do so a bit at a time so as not to shock the body.

Wish me luck. Confused

Steve

hey bawdy and Karen,
Cortiol is your flight or fight hormone ,In the prehistoric days when a caveman came upon a saber tooth,he either stood his ground and fought or he ran a way like a little sissy..fight or flight..So that is part of our inherit makeup.

Now on the belly fat issue. Cotislim started this hype,,belly fat is not from cortisol,it is from insulin.. Stress can casue weight gain,but cortisol is not the main culprit. Stress can be very catabolic as well,resulitng in the loss of muscle tissue. So controlling cortisol can help build muscle.

There product contained some Marigold extract..the problem is it didn't have enough to supress cortisol. they got into trouble from the FDA and the FTC and were told to cease with their ads.

BawdyWench

Hey, Steve! Thanks for the response to my PM. You mentioned once before that cortisol is not associated with belly fat, but I've read scientific articles that say it is. I'd have to google it again to find it. No matter.

I was able to talk with another nurse on the way to the airport the other day. They have now taken me off everything except the multi, the calcium, the magnesium, and the fish oil. (I'm also taking potassium and borage oil, which I will continue to take.)

They took me off ALL the adrenal-support supps, except for the cortaid, which they still want me to take, but half dosage. I was taking two upon arising and another two at mid-morning; now they want me to take one on arising and one mid-morning. I didn't take my extra supps with me, just the basic ones (which I also neglected to take while away).

They also want me to keep taking the estrogen and progesterone and the DHEA. The problem, though, is I think the DHEA is causing my skin to break out now. Not all over, but I'm getting these huge hard nodules, like a pimple but not really, at the edge of my scalp. Not terribly attractive! So I'm going to stop that also for several days and then try again MUCH more slowing in upping the dosage.

Still a lot of research to do. Steve told me about guggulipids, and I'm going to the health food store tomorrow to see if their stock has arrived. I'll also start taking alpha-lipoic acid (50 g at each meal) to see if anything makes any difference.

Geez. Since I started seeing this NP in February, I've now gained at least 15 pounds more, and spent about $800 in supplements.

Roll Eyes

Steve

The problem with dhea is it converts to estrogen and testosterone..estrogen not good for men,test not good for the women,

Ask them about 7-keto. 7 keto does all the cool stuff that DHEA does with out the conversion to est or test.

Don't believe the cotisol bs..High levels of cortisol are anticatabolic.

Cortisol can cause weight gain in some,but the belly fat is insulin or estrogen..especially in men.

BawdyWench

You may be right, but SOMETHING has made me gain 15 pounds of belly fat in the past 3 weeks. I do take progesterone (between the 15th and 30th of each month except this one because I forgot!), and I'm supposed to be taking 2 drops of estrogen on the wrist twice a day, but have frequently forgotten THAT lately also.

(The estrogen and progesterone are human hormones from a compounding pharmacist.)

I'm seriously thinking about dropping this also.

I'm just so confused at this point, I don't know which way to turn. And I need to lose this fat. I feel awful -- my body doesn't move right and doesn't feel right.

For starters, I'm going to do the multi, fish oil, borage oil, magnesium, potassium, guggulipids, and alpha-lipoic acid. Should I add C to that also?

Steve

Vit C is really an excellent cortisol inhibitor as well..that is a vitamin everybody should take IMO.

here is a little something on 7-keto,but do ask your doc what they think

http://www.hbcprotocols.com/keto/qa.html

I think the dhea may be a problem for you. You can gain weight on it. It is a mild androgen. When it was "allowed" back on the market in the mid 90's I had a lot of people tell me they were experiencing some sort of acne.

don't get frustrated, you know enough to rectify things and you are a good sleuth!! Yup

BawdyWench

Well, I've been AWOL since Monday, but with very good reason. Monday night I went to bed around 8:30 and DH stayed up a little later, til around 9:30. Before coming to bed, he let the dog (Shelby) outside to "do her duty."

The next morning I let Shelby out and then went to fix her breakfast. I noticed that unmistakeable odor coming from the living room and sure enough, she had pooped all over. So I cleaned it up. I think it stresses her out when she has to poop indoors, so there were a couple solid pieces and then lots of splats. Anyway, I cleaned it up. Then I noticed a couple spots of throw-up (just saliva) on the area rug. That, I figured was a cat. Didn't think twice about it. (Don't you just love animals?)

Then I went to let Shelby in. She didn't want to. I did the sing-song thing about breakfast, and still she didn't want to. When she's had to poop indoors, she gets all upset, like she's embarrassed and doesn't want to come to me. I told her it was ok and to come have her breakfast. Nothing. So I tried bribing her with a Meaty Bone. Nope.

I had to go to work, but DH was home all day. She got progressively worse through the day. Drinking a ton of water and then throwing it up immediately, loose stools, and finally she couldn't go at all. She'd strain and strain.

By Wednesday morning she was much worse so DH took her to the vet. Severely dehydrated, and her blood work was all over the chart. The vet had no clue. She was on IV fluids and antibiotics all day. Her white count was low, which was weird.

Since they weren't staffed overnight, we brought her home and then took her back the next day for another day of IV and antibiotics.

I picked her up again Thursday night, and she was doing better. We got her home, into a good environment, and she perked up slightly. Last night was better, and then this morning she's almost back to her old self. She's on antibiotics twice a day, and Sucralfate (to coat her stomach) for another couple days.

The last time she ate anything was Monday evening. Friday I was able to get maybe a tablespoon of meat into her. The vet wanted me to give her this awful stuff in a can that was mostly white rice. She turned up her nose at that (good girl!). Then the vet wanted me to boil hamburger and then mix it with an equal amount of white rice and give it to her a tablespoon at a time. Not likely. I had a cubed steak (minute steak) in the freezer, so I thawed it and nuked small pieces of it. She finally ate a bit of that.

Then, DH had the brilliant idea that maybe the huge wrap that was still around her leg (from the IV) was bothering her, so I held her down while he cut it off. It made all the difference in the world! As soon as it was off, she "asked" for some food and ate it right down.

This morning she's doing much better. She wanted her regular food, so that's what she got. She usually gets a cup with some water, but we're giving her 1/3 cup at a time, just to be sure she can keep it down.

So, another crisis resolved.

OUR eating has been off the charts, too. I had no desire to do ANY cooking -- did I mention that I stayed up with her all night every night, sleeping only 30 or so minutes at a time since Monday? So we ended up having pizza one night, KFC the next night, and subs the next night.

Tonight I'm making something GOOD and MEATY!!!

DH has to leave on a business trip tomorrow morning, so it's a good time to rededicate myself.

More later!

Suzanne

Whew! I'm glad your fur kid is better. Sounds like a rough week.

BawdyWench

Thanks. She's definitely on the mend. Not 100% yet, but getting there. But I'm exhausted! It's a good thing DH was home this week, I don't know how I could have done it without him. He cleaned up messes, mopped, did laundry, stayed with her during the day, day after day. Today I'm having major motivation problems. Looks like it will be a laid-back weekend.

BawdyWench

OH!!!!!!! I just remembered something I wanted to share with you guys!

Last week while in Michigan on "family business," I took my mother-in-law and aunt-in-law to dinner at a Red Robin (like a Chili's or Applebee's). The waitress came over and asked if we wanted a beverage to start. I said I'd like a margarita.

"May I see your ID, please?"

WHAT?!?!?!??!?!!?

"I need to see your ID, please."

You're joking, right? I'm 51 for god's sake!

"I really need to see your ID!"

I told her I had crow's feet older than her, but got out my license. Yup. 51.

Geez! LOL

Bobi

That's a great compliment, Bawdy! Sorry to hear about your dog and happy to hear that she is on the mend. Animals are so much a part of our family, aren't they?

Dean

Bawdy,

So glad to hear about Shelby doing better! It is SO HARD to have to deal with them getting ill. I'm really glad things have improved for her! Hang in there, and let us know how she's doing.

Big Hug

BawdyWench

Hi, Bobi! Hi, Dean!

Shelby is doing MUCH better, thanks for asking. She ate a regular breakfast today, and is much perkier. She seems to still want to sleep a lot, but then who doesn't!

Today I'm re-dedicating myself. DH has to leave on a business trip, so it's a good time to hunker down and concentrate on just me. OK, so we had those Pillsbury cinnamon rolls for breakfast, but that was it. Clean eating from now on.

Now that I'm off all those stupid supplements (and ON the ones that I really think might help me), I'm hoping my body will start reacting to food and exercise the way it should. We shall see!

Jessica

Bawdy, good for you on the clean eating again. I've found exercise really helps me with body changes. And the endorphins are great too!

Jessica

BawdyWench

Just for the record, I updated my supplements list and my adrenal stress index results above (first couple posts in my journal).

BawdyWench

Time to get serious. I won't go into details, but I'm trying something just a little different -- only a tweak, but this is how I ate when I managed to lose a lot in the past.

I stepped on the scale yesterday, and it's official. I have now gained 41 pounds since the ugly menopause monster raised his (his -- it's gotta be male, because no woman would do this to another woman) ugly head.

So, it began yesterday. I'm hesitant to say how much I weigh at this point. Why, since we all do this every day?

Nope. Not doing it quite yet.

Suffice it to say, I'm down 3 pounds since yesterday. Sure it's water, but it's a start and it's definitely a boost.

I'll keep you posted.

Shawn

I hear you on the "menopause monster" that is when I started to gain weight and couldn't lose until I went low carb.

Congratulations on the three pound loss! Sunny

BawdyWench

Down another 3 pounds this morning. That's 6 in two days and counting!

This will be my third day, and what I think of as the "hump" day. Even though I can't say I have been ravenously hungry between meals (except for about the half hour to an hour before the next meal), today should be the end of that as ketosis sets in. I love that feeling when food has no draw and it doesn't call to me.

Alisa

I can't wait for the details of what you're doing. Six pounds in 2 days in great, and it sounds like your body is responding. I'm so glad you're feeling better! Big Hug

Shawn

You are doing great! Please share Yup

.

BawdyWench

Strangely, there's not much to share. Calories are around 1100, equal percentages of fat and protein, and very low carb. The first day it was 18 carbs (no fiber subtracted), the second day it was 5 carbs, and today so far is 0 carbs. I don't count the carbs in eggs.

I've had no dairy and no alcohol. Lots of fluids -- mostly Crystal Lite diluted with 3 times the amount of water (way too sweet otherwise), but also some plain water and some bottled sparkling water.

The key, I think (and it's WAY too early to be giving advice or drawing conclusions) is no bites/swallows of ANYTHING off plan. I've made DH mashed potatoes the first two nights, and normally I might have a small amount (maybe 1/4 cup) or at least lick the spoon. Not even that. NOTHING. No starchy carbs, no alcohol.

Today I took a leisurely 30-minute walk around the back yard (we have 45 acres, so you can walk for a good long time!). Other than that, no exercise.

Wish there was more I could tell you. So far, so good!

Susanne

BawdyWench

You're right, Susanne. For the past several weeks, something I read in the Atkins book has been going over and over in my mind. He said that one cheat, one bite of anything off plan, was the kiss of death on his diet. When I first did Atkins, I took this to heart. I decided I was going to do it -- at least for the 2 weeks -- and never looked back. It was probably a year before I had even a slice of pizza. I remember having bread on occasion, but only a bit.

As much as I railed against it, I do now believe that you can't be as cavalier on a low-carb diet as you can on a low-fat diet. That's a fact, and I might as well face it now.

Susanne

Well, if you want pizza, I've posted a fabulous recipe from KevinPa from ALC. Just made it again today - the best LC pizza I've found yet. It's in our Miscellaneous section. Even my Kid will eat it - and she's the World's Pickiest 12 year old.

Which compels me to share the 2nd secret to my success - FIND LOW CARB (or whatever plan you are) SUBSTITUTES for the 'real' foods you love. Then, when you get to jonesing for something or the family is eating similar, you have an alternative to feeling like you've just GOT to have the 'real' thing. That has worked SO well for me. Yup

BawdyWench

It's funny what works for people. I was never into substitutes. They're never as good as the real thing, and I can't seem to avoid the comparisons. Pizza doesn't really have a hold on me, I just used that as an example.

The one thing I do crave from time to time is simply something crunchy. That's when I buy some pork rinds and sour-cream-and-onion dip. I've also been wanting to try fricos (or something like that). Basically, it's just baked cheese and gets crispy.

I know some people do a free day from time to time, and maybe I'll do that, too. Not for a long time, though. Our wedding anniversay is coming up on November 18, so I know that day won't count, as we'll be going to my favorite restaurant. But it will be worth it, saving up for that one special day.

Of course, this is how I feel now. I just might come looking for that pizza recipe sometime real soon!

LOL

Steve

way to go bawdy!!

Once your in ketosis,will you still be Bawdy? LOL

BawdyWench

"When I'm good, I've very good. But when I'm bad, I'm even better!"

Karen

BAWDY!!

so glad to see you have found a way to start losing again and glad its working for you! Its so easy to let one cheat turn into constant cheating for months. i always lost WELL when on true low carb.but when i started tweaking everythign it all went to hell. sometimes we stay in denial far too long. Stick with under 20 carbs a day and i bet you will continue to lose. high fat/low carb DOES work well.

BawdyWench

Thanks, Karen. But I'm not doing high-fat/low-carb. I was doing high-fat ZERO carb and it didn't work for me at all. It's only when I dropped the fat (from around 80% to 50%) that things started moving for me.

We all need to find our own way. Glad I'm back!

BawdyWench

This is the start of Day 4 for me, and I'm down another pound, making for a 7-pound loss so far!

I knew the 3-pound loss per day couldn't continue, but it was sure the boost I needed!

Steve

Way to go bawdy, feels good to see that scale number drop eh?

I too lately am starting to change my thought process with high fat for everyone.

I have a bodybuilder friend who I work with and he came to me and said he wasn't losing any weight.
I asked what he was eating. He said "Just about zero carbs and high protein and high fat"

I asked ,what specifically are you eating?

get this

Ground beef mixed in mayonaisse!! 4 times a day..

He was in Ketosis,but there was no drop in the scale.

So we decide to go lean protein, low carb and medium fat in the form of egg yolks,fish oils and fat from meat,
He would have some non-starchy veggies as well..

Well within a few days the scale started to move south..

So was the hamburger and mayo, just to high fat or to high calorically?

I think a little bit of both. I think some people just handle high amounts of fat better than others.

this could be to due ancestry,metabolic makeup and I know I'm going to start some shit,but types of calories consumed.

I think once someone gets to a certain bodyfat% ,calories do count

Dean

Steve,

I think calories always count. When you have a LOT of weight to lose, your calorie needs are way higher, so you can eat a lot and still lose. I know that even eating total junk food, including white flour and sugar, I have lost weight and body fat... as long as the calories were low. The energy requirements for the human body are FINITE. Therefore, one cannot just eat tons and tons of fat and expect it to vanish into thin air inside your body. There is a pathway to STORE it to fat! While there are nutrient dense foods, there are also calorically dense foods. Fat is the most nutrient AND calorically dense food there is.

BawdyWench

Well said, Steve and Dean. I know Rob (from another board) eats tons of fat and protein and is losing pounds, but he's also a whole lot bigger than me. Dean, you're right. I find it hard to believe, as others have said, that it doesn't matter at all how much fat you eat -- in the absence of carbs, it will NOT be stored as fat. Well, it's gotta go somewhere! Calories HAVE to count at some level.

And Steve, it's hard to argue with results!

As I put in my signature, "Truth does not depend on a consensus of opinion." I don't care if people disagree with me. If it works, so be it.

Steve

Oh my god, The Bear is going to put a hit on you guys.. Shock

we all know a calorie is not a calorie..we here believe that carbs are bad for weight loss,but still it come down to burning more calories than you take in.

for myself that is not always set itn stone. Now that I have a metabolic disorder,dropping carbs works remarkably well.

but I have noticed that eating high amounts of fats, does put weight on me even in the absence of carbs.

Is it because I am now over 40? Yeah I believe my metabolism has slowed down,but I seem to not digest fats like I once did.

Maybe I should use a digestive enzyme ,like lipase or HCL

Maybe one should alter between high and low fat days for better utilization of macronutrients and to keep ones metabolism off kilter a little..

so what do you think? Low/no carb,moderate fat,moderate protein?

BawdyWench

All I can say is what seems to be working for me right now. Next week my body may react differently. I do think age has a lot to do with it. That's why teenagers and those in their 20s can eat and drink like there's no tomorrow and not gain an ounce.

Youth IS wasted on the young! LOL

Dean

Youth ARE wasted... and on top of that, they're YOUNG! Wink

It just doesn't seem fair, now does it? Sad

BawdyWench

Not a damn bit. Not a damn bit.

BawdyWench

I am so frustrated with W2W. I went yesterday morning. She asked how I was feeling, I said "better." She asked how I've been sleeping, I said "better." She says it sounds like I'm doing well. I said, "well, other than the ADDITIONAL 20 pounds I've gained since you prescribed all those supplements."

She looked up and was shocked. The supplements didn't do that, she said. So I asked, Then why are my cortisol levels so high? Oh, it's high because your body is pumping out more cortisol. (Duh.) But, I said, it's pumping it out because of the supplements. No, she said, it doesn't work that way. Then why did you give me supplements? To raise your cortisol, she said. But the supplements didn't make my cortisol high? No.

Huh?

So I started asking another question and she interrupted me and said, "Well I'm not going to argue with you." I said, very calmly, I'm not arguing, I'm trying to understand.

She was saying both things at the same time.

Then she said I gained weight because I'm overeating and my metabolism has tanked. That's when she laid down the rules: NO SUGAR! CARBS BELOW 100!

Who the heck did she think she was talking to? At our last appointment she was arguing with me because I wasn't eating ENOUGH carbs. It's like she never looked at my history. If she had, she would have seen that I've been low-carbing for a good 6 or 7 years now, and that I had been staying below 20 grams of carbs for a good long time.

It's like she wasn't even listening to me. She must have said "no sugar" about 6 times, like she didn't believe what I was telling her.

So, on my own I've stopped all the supplements she prescribed other than the multi and the fish oil. (On my own I take borage oil, potassium, and magnesium.)

I'm going back to what has worked for me in the past. Low carb (below 20 grams per day), no alcohol, and moderate exercise.

I started this last Friday (October 6) and to date I have lost 7 pounds. I just hope this does the trick.

Bobi

Good for you, Bawdy! Excellent

Suzanne

Yep! Listen to your body and what you know works for you. Happy

BawdyWench

You said it!

Going in to the appointment, I decided I'd listen to her take on the situation, and then make up my own mind what I wanted to do. In earlier appointments, she had mentioned she wanted me to do a cleanse diet called Isagenix, not sure for how long -- the one-week plan is $89, and the one-month plan is almost $400. It's all supplements and shakes and bars. No thank you!

At my last physical when I was discussing all this with my regular doctor (whom I really like and respect), he told me that he had other female patients who had gone to W2W, and that they all had negative experiences. Now I know why.

Suzanne

I've tried the Isagenix. Save your money. Stuff is nasty and I couldn't do it. Sounds to me like you're wasting time and money with this person you're going to.

Listen to your inner self. It knows.

BawdyWench

Oh, I ain't goin' back ... believe it!

Heather

Wow and good for you! I've realized "alot" of doctor's, nurses only know what they are taught. Most have such a dependence on prescription drugs, they think it's the only possible solution to any problem.

I went to the drug store the other day to buy make up and the cosmetics lady asked of I also bought my prescriptions at the same place, which really made me think, first of all, what prescriptions, secondly, when was the last time I had a prescription, oh yeah, the last time I had a prescription I did buy it there. That was in May when one child broke his arm, he had a painkiller prescribed, before that I don't remember.

For some people it's a way of life.

BawdyWench

Bobi

Aging? What's that anyway? It's a state of mind! I'm going to be 60 in January and I take the occasional aspirin for stress head-aches, that's it! My life is way too busy to dwell on my age. LOL

BawdyWench

Oooooh, I love that attitude!

Yup

Karen

hey bawdy!

i am glad you have found what works for you and you are listening to your gut instead of some doctor! Great job on the weight loss recently! I do think that some people do better on higher fat than others..and part of it might be how much is still needed to lose! you arent THAT MUCH overweight!! Do your thing..its working!! Good for you!! huggs.
karen

Suzanne

Yoooo HOOO! Anyone home?

BawdyWench

I'm here. Just extremely busy. Working from home today, but ended up taking most of the day off. We have a couple carpenters here from a "big box store" putting in some doors. Need to watch them like a hawk!

I'll come visit this weekend.

Sunny

BawdyWench

Tomorrow for sure. Just hanging in there. No progress. I need to just get serious again. It just sucks that it gets harder and harder with time.

Poor me. Roll Eyes

Tomorrow I'm going out for a day of shopping with a friend. Looking forward to it. I need a few new clothes, probably skirts. I've gained some, but I still look awesome in a skirt. Great legs.

I'll try to catch up tomorrow evening.

Dean

Hey, Bawdy!

Good to see ya around! Happy

Steve

Hey let's see those legs miss Bawdy..

BawdyWench

Wow, you MUST be feeling better -- you're getting frisky on us again!

As a matter of fact, you just MIGHT see my legs. Yesterday at work I sent an email to the wrong person. Shock

A friend from work and I had gone shopping on Sunday and had a great time. We both bought a ton of stuff.

One of the things I bought was a killer purse -- olive green suede with pouch pockets and a cute clasp. I also ordered some killer shoes to match -- olive gren suede with brass studs (did I mention 4-inch stiletto heels with sharp-as-a-razor pointed toes?).

Anyway, at one point during the day, I sent her an email that just said, "I love my purse and shoes!"

Unfortunately, I sent it to the wrong person (I had just typed in the first couple letters, and Outlook filled in the rest).

The person who received it was one of our team on the road. Well, pretty soon everyone on the team was emailing me teasing me about the purse and shoes.

Finally, I wrote to all of them and said, "HEY! I'm a hard-working, serious-minded professional ... who just happens to also look FABULOUS!"

LOL

So, when the shoes arrive, I was going to take a picture of "feet and purse" and send it off. I'll post it here, too!

Steve

I find it amazing that women are so in to their purses and accessories.

My mother -in-law just loves purses and is always picking up new ones.

I had an ex girlfriend who I never saw in the same pair of shoes.. ever.

Of course I'm into snakes so go figure.

Feet and purses are an excellent start,but again for the sake of science,we need legs shots.

I'm sure my fellow male Bus riders would agree Devil

BawdyWench

OK, you wore me down. How's this?

Steve

Are you playing around??

That looks like a professional pic Miss Bawdy..did you have some done for you hubby??

If that is you I have one thing to say.

HOLY SWEET JESUS OF PEARL..

I didn't know I could do a back flip. Grin

BawdyWench

I thought that would get your attention! Devil

Steve

Quick, get the defribrillator, stat!!!!

My palpitations are now full blown coronary episode..
My eyes are glazed,must wipe the drool from my lip..

You know we must ask for more now right?

I mean it is the next logical step in the equation.

did you have that profesionally done?[/i]

Heather

BawdyWench

Steve

Bad Bwdy,very bad..

http://www2.victoriassecret.com/category/?cgnbr=OSSHUZZZZZZ

I guess I deserve that

Heather

OMG STEVE!

My dreams have come true:

Where's the mastercard?????? Devil

Steve

Mine too!!

hell with your black thong..I'll buy them for you!!!

Heather

BawdyWench: All the Bawdy Details!

My Body Log (Searching for that Bawdy Body)

Miscellaneous